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McCain: Bush Should Veto Anti-Torture Bill
No real surprise here. Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) voted against a bill in the Senate that would have confined the CIA to interrogations outlined in the Army Field Manual -- that means no ambiguity about the use of waterboarding or other "enhanced interrogation" techniques. We explained his position at length here.
The President has threatened to veto the bill, and because sometime swing votes like McCain, Sen. Arlen Specter (R-PA), and Lindsey Graham (R-SC) oppose it, a veto override vote in the Senate seems certain to fail. Today, McCain told reporters that Bush should veto the bill and said he's banking on the consistency of his position on the issue of torture overriding the subtlety of his stance. From the AP:
"I think I can show my record is clear. I said there should be additional techniques allowed to other agencies of government as long as they were not" torture."I was on the record as saying that they could use additional techniques as long as they were not cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment," McCain said. "So the vote was in keeping with my clear record of saying that they could have additional techniques, but those techniques could not violate" international rules against torture.
Of course, that's the administration's position, too: we don't "torture."
Interestingly, McCain also took the opportunity to outline a real difference between himself and the president: he says that if he were elected president, he wouldn't use signing statements -- those statements Bush has tacked on to a number of important bills (including McCain's anti-torture amendment) that essentially say, "NOT." As McCain put it: "If I disagree with a law that's passed, I'll veto it."
Comments (23)
Well, McStain was tortured, and we KNOW that torture works, so McStain revealed state secrets. This makes McStain a traitor, not a hero. He has no business leading this great nation.
February 20, 2008 2:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Before McCain changed his position on this, I would have voted for him in the General if Clinton got the Democratic nomination.
Now, I won't. I admired him because he stuck to his principles. Now, in order to appeal to the most extreme segment of the Republican party, he's changed his position in order to get their support.
Some flip-flopping I can accept. Positions change, the world changes. Flip flopping on THIS subject, I cannot accept.
It's disappointing to see such an honorable man destroy his own principles and reputation just to win a nomination he probably would have won anyway.
February 20, 2008 3:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
It would be, if McCain was indeed an honorable man. The myth of his "honor" was just another media creation by a very manipulative politician courting the sycophants in the press. As it is, it is not a disappointment to see him exposed, but a relief.
March 8, 2008 6:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
Does anyone out there know what the World Court thinks of our way of questioning people? Would the World Court convict a number of our lawmakers if they were tried there?
February 20, 2008 3:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Can McCain clarify specifically what additional techniques are OK? Stress positions OK? Hypothermia OK? I'd love to know what is OK for our gov't to do in our name. And specifics would allow the public to deal with the reality of what has been done, not vague generalities like "enhanced techniques."
February 20, 2008 3:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
I love it. By November, McCain will be GW Bush. One and the same. He should start practicing his smirk.
February 20, 2008 3:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
He's on record as saying that torture doesn't work. Now he takes this disgusting stance. The GOP's support is already quickly dissolving so who the hell does he think he's pandering to??
February 20, 2008 3:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
John McCain is now an official flip-flopping bastard.
"Recently, Sen. McCain has come out strongly against using waterboarding as an instrument of interrogation," Jones said.
"My question for the rest of you is, considering that Mr. McCain is the only one with any firsthand knowledge on the subject, how can those of you sharing the stage with him disagree with his position?" he said.
"I oppose torture," Romney said. "I would not be in favor of torture in any way, shape or form."
Prompted by the moderator as to whether waterboarding was torture, Romney said "as a presidential candidate, I don't think it's wise for us to describe specifically which measures we would and would not use."
McCain's response was passionate: "Well, governor, I'm astonished that you haven't found out what waterboarding is."
"I know what waterboarding is, Senator," Romney said.
"Then I am astonished that you would think such a torture would be inflicted on anyone in our — who we held captive and anyone could believe that that's not torture. It's in violation of the Geneva Convention," McCain said.Douchebag.
February 20, 2008 3:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Bravo.
Perfectly written.
“The healthy man does not torture others - generally it is the tortured who turn into torturers”
--Carl Gustav Jung
February 20, 2008 3:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't like McCain. I don't think he deserves to be ridiculed because he cooperated after torture.
(The evidence suggests that McCain told the Vietnamese that his dad was and admiral after torture.)
I think a greater liability is his inability to follow orders and lack of loyalty.
He critized "Rolling Thunder" because he did not understand why the orders were issued. He risked himself his plane and the CSR crews that would have gone to rescue him. He should have obeyed as the raids were designed to avoid the A-30's like the one that eventualyy took his plane down. I remember hearing that he would have been diciplined if his dad was not and Admiral.
He also almost abandoned the republican party when things did not go his way. (By the way, we should revive some of the vicious attacks Bush used against him in the 2000 primaries).
February 20, 2008 4:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
so mccain signed a false confession under torture
or did he ???
guess we're gonna have to find out what techniques the Vietnamese used on mccain
that confession might be valid under the repuglitards' hairsplitting of international law
February 20, 2008 4:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
Shouldn't the headline read:
"McCain begs pResident to keep hope of torture alive until he get into office."
Once a fascist plutocrat, always a fascist plutocrat . . .
February 20, 2008 4:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
The real question is: if these additional techniques are not torture and "not cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment", why aren't we letting our military use them?
February 20, 2008 5:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's easy to dismiss this as just another concession to all the knuckle-draggers in the Republican party. But it's also a good indication of the type of campaign McCain will conduct against OBama.
He's going to claim that he's the only candidate with the experience and willingness to do what needs to be done to protect America. His willingness to torture is just another line buttressing that argument. It's his way of saying to the American public "Do you want a president who is going to do whatever he needs to do to protect your family, or are you going to vote for someone who won't."
It doesn't matter that McCain is a complete hypocrite on the subject or that torture really doesn't work. It's directed at people's fears and insecurities and it will help to sharpen the contrast between him and Obama. Most Americans will say they are against torture, but most will vote for the candidate that makes them feel more secure. The public's hypocrisy on the subject is the same as McCain's. That's why it was a smart move by McCain.
February 20, 2008 6:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
So far, no one's been out there making the argument that this country shouldn't let terror win, by allowing fear to cause us to forget who we are and what we're supposed to stand for. It's time to remind ourselves that we don't have to become LIKE our enemies in order to win - and that if we do become like them, we lose, period.
Hard to believe we are actually having these kinds of debates in this country. And really sad.
This is not the first time McCain has claimed to be against torture, but turned out to be more adverse to opposing whatever georgejr wanted.
February 20, 2008 6:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
So Senator, what you're trying to say is that you voted against torture before you voted for it?
February 20, 2008 7:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's so sad.
February 20, 2008 9:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear John McCain,
Please save what little dignity and humanity you have left and just vote 'present' on this bill. Don't embarass yourself any more!
February 20, 2008 11:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
Of all the things to flip flop on. I used to respect this guy, not anymore. Very sad.
February 21, 2008 8:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
It sounds to me like "Mr. Straight Talk" has been looking at the polling of Republican primary voters as it pertains to this issue.
February 27, 2008 3:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
For me, this issue comes down to a very simple question: "Would we accept the use of a particular interrogation technique on one of our soldiers?" I'm surprised this question isn't posed more often to people like McCain, who want to keep our "interrogation options open."
March 8, 2008 8:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
McCain supports torture, and........
Hillary has been running around endorsing John McCain. He has said that he is going to have the same foreign and domestic policies as George W. Bush. Yet Hillary has endorsed him, over Senator Obama. That makes Hillary just another traitor to the party. She is just the same as Joe Lieberman, and should be given the same treatment. She should be driven out of the party. She is not a loyal Democrat, any more than Joe Lieberman was.
March 8, 2008 10:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
Announcing: The First Annual Torture Technology Convention, September 11, 2009, in Las Vegas, NV.
Booths, exhibits, seminars on the latest military and university research on the infliction of pain, workshops on writing grants to study torture techniques, real-life demonstrations with actual detainees from Guantanamo Bay. Keynote address by John McCain: "I know torture works, because it worked on me."
March 8, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink