Comments (17)

ifthethunderdontgetya wrote on July 13, 2007 4:49 PM:

Cheney and Bush have failed. The longer we wait to admit it, the more other people are going to suffer.

bobh wrote on July 13, 2007 4:58 PM:

What a useless bunch of idiots the Iraqis have turned out to be. Theyre so interested in killing Americans they can't get organized and kill each other. The cheek!

Note to Iraqis: There is no prize for trying to our-incompetent the Bush Admin. none at all. Please start behaving as if you had a brain.

Samsara wrote on July 13, 2007 5:02 PM:

Don’t you worry General Pace, we won't read too much into this latest bit of bad news. After all, there are still six units operating independently, so I guess the glass is a little more than half full.
Enjoy your retirement.

Bob wrote on July 13, 2007 6:23 PM:

His words echo the Rumsfeldian purge of all independent critical thinkers from the upper echelons of the military during the reign of Emperor Bush II. America needs some Generals with more battle leadership skill than Cold war political sensibilities for a change. The days of America being able to afford having politician hack Generals is at an end. We need real leadership similar to that of Patton and MacArthur, rather than uniformed politicians like Pace, Myers and their predecessors for the last 50 years.

TheraP wrote on July 13, 2007 8:47 PM:

I agree the Iraqis are not standing up. On the other hand it seems to me that after decades of being oppressed, and now being occupied and daily assaulted in their homes, that these people are simply burnt out.

I cannot blame people who are totally worn out, burnt out, and whose daily life has been simply erased - for seeming to drag their feet.

Yes, it's time for us to leave in an orderly way. And to leave an international peace-keeping force behind in our stead. But what good does it do to blame the Iraqis for our stupidity and arrogance? Well, honestly, I blame bush for that. But likely they blame us - and rightly so!

Steve5117 wrote on July 13, 2007 9:36 PM:

TheraP

How can we get upet at people doing what they have been done there for thousands of years.

Anonymous wrote on July 13, 2007 10:23 PM:

Narrow band? Minor variations? Going from 10 to 6 is a 40% drop! Is Pace saying there has been a 40% casualty rate among Iraqi troops? If so, they have been trained to do little more than get themselves killed.

Why do people sit there when Pace and Gates make stuff up like this? They are playing the American public for fools. And why don't the reporters ever challenge them on statements like this? Whose side are they on?

Samsara wrote on July 13, 2007 10:43 PM:

The Iraqis are tired all right, tired of us being in their country. Let me say that again, because I often seem to forget it when I think about this problem, THEIR COUNTRY.

oldtree wrote on July 13, 2007 11:37 PM:

General Pace wasn't able to reveal that these missing divisions are going on vacation during August with their tribal leaders in the parliament. He can't call them bodyguards, because that makes them enemy combatants and this only confuses the people at the embassy. They have enough little insurgent problems to keep track of.

strangelet wrote on July 14, 2007 6:12 AM:

BATTALIONS???? We're worrying about whether there are six or ten Iraqi BATTALIONS that can operate independently? Oy vey.

A battalion is generally between 500 to 1000 men. So the ostensible big concern here is: how many Iraqi troops can operate independently -- 3000 or 10000? Neither of these numbers is big enough to matter. As we used to say: With all due respect to General Pace, he's ignoring the real problem.

TheraP wrote on July 14, 2007 9:32 AM:

Steve5117:

Perhaps the Iraqis have learned after centuries of wars and occupations that their best option is to simply keep their heads down and wait out the wars and occupations.

I honestly don't think we can "get" the Iraqis to do anything. That's where conquerers and occupiers go wrong to start with!

So I agree. They've been doing what they're doing for centuries now, millenia. And we might as well leave them to it.

And yes, Samsara, it's their country. Amen!

We'd be better off trying to get "our" country on track.

As for generals, I'm done listening to any that are still serving now. Seems like the only way people get promotions (or are allowed to have press conferences these days) is if they pledge allegiance to bush. So when bush turns around and wants us to listen to his generals, well it's nothing more than circular reasoning!

Dear God, let this come to some kind of sand conclusion already.

Steve5117 wrote on July 14, 2007 10:42 AM:

TheraP

I had lunch yesterday with my right-wing friend who beleives that speaking out against the President means you don't support the troops. I posed the question to him about what the average America would or should if China decided to invade the US for it's coal and oil resources.

When he said he would arm himself and defend his country, I told him that that is exactly what the Iraqis have done against us.

Yesterday I explained to my friend one reason why Pelosi took impeachment off the table was to avoid the political backlash from her being the one who would become Vice President. Today I no longer feel that way.

Impeach Bush and Cheney now is my new mantra after watching Bill Moyers' Journal last night. Moyers had a conversation about impeachment with Bruce Fein and John Nichols. The main point I came away with is: Impeachment is not a constitutional crisis - Impeachment is the cure. Don't mistake the medicine for the cure.

Look for this program on your PBS station or pbs.org and take notes!

JEP wrote on July 14, 2007 10:50 AM:

Here's some headlines you will never see;
Iraqi police come to the rescue...
Iraqi military drives out local factions...

What a bunch of drivel... the Iraqi police ARE the local factions...

...read this!

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/14/world/middleeast/14iraq.html

katie wrote on July 14, 2007 10:55 AM:

"Marine General Peter Pace, conceded the point, and clarified that the number of Iraqi Army battalions operating independently has declined from ten in January to six today."

And they will continue to grow and drop. Why? Because the Iraqis "join" the military, get trained and get armed and then defect to the insurgents fully trained and armed courtesy of the US government. It's a sweet deal for the insurgents!

wagonjak wrote on July 14, 2007 12:05 PM:

For some reason I thought this pathetic excuse for a soldier was already gone from the scene...

With his long Nixonesque nose perfectly shaped for inserting in the backside of higher ups in the Bush administration, he backed up every wrong move and assertion about the Iraq War by this administration.

Please Go Away Peter...you've done more then enough damage to the services and this country.

Anna Griffin wrote on July 14, 2007 12:46 PM:

We called people who predicted this five years ago "liberals" and "defeatists", yet they have now turned out to be realists and soothsayers!
And we will probably bet for a bunch of Republicrats again in a year!!!

TheraP wrote on July 14, 2007 1:00 PM:

Steve5117:

Thanks for the good advice.

You know, I was first for impeachment 4 or 5 years ago. And then I saw the "light" about Pelosi being the one to gain, once she became speaker. I could see we needed to bide our time.

But now I've begun to swing back - just as you have - and that's due to the apparent and increasing evidence that bush is simply delusional. Even right wingers are beginning to notice! (witness that piece by Peggy Noonan in WSJ ... SHE now calls his behavior "weird!")

So, the fact that we can be open to reason - and change our minds with the advent of new information, that is sanity and wisdom. And I sense the tide is turning.