"pragmatism"? Prostitution would be far more apropos.

Posted at July 3, 2008 7:16 PM in response to Obama Responds To FISA Group On His Web Site

Keep filling up that cup with the Kool Aid friend! You're gonna need it!

It strikes me that true believers such as yourself really are just the flip side of the Bush coin in that you only want to hear what you agree with and you try to shut down and turn off any opinions you disagree with. How sad that your mind is so limited.

Posted at July 3, 2008 7:13 PM in response to Obama Responds To FISA Group On His Web Site

All this is, is Obama's version of Hillary's refusal to admit she was wrong on Iraq. Same losing logic in both instances. He has responded more smoothly but that's all. He's got the nomination now, he doesn't need to listen to anyone outside the beltway.

Posted at July 3, 2008 6:46 PM in response to Obama Responds To FISA Group On His Web Site

What I find most remarkable about this entirely stupid idea of bombing Iran is how little both Israel and the Bush regime have learned from their failed attack on Lebanon which blew up in their face big time. Are they so blind and/or stupid or both that they don't see that this will make the incursion into Lebanon look like nothing? The whole notion is so breathtakingly irresponsible and counterproductive it is difficult to understand how anyone would think this a good idea or that it would in any way advance the cause of stability or peace in the middle east. It's simply shocking.

Posted at July 3, 2008 3:18 PM in response to October Surprise: Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb...Bomb Iran

You seem to object to holding St. Obama accountable. Accountability is at the very heart of what has gone wrong in our country the past 7 years and it is at the very heart of the FISA issue. Obama is attempting to abandon his clear and in his words "unequivocal" opposition to telecom immunity and to using "security" to push through bad legislation. There is nothing wrong with holding this politician accountable like any other particularly when he claims he is not like the rest and then behaves exactly like the rest as he has done by flip-flopping on FISA.

Posted at July 3, 2008 2:58 PM in response to A Time-line Of Obama's Statements On FISA

Keep the kool aid handy cause you're gonna need.

Does no one else include the now nearly 17,000 Obama supporters who have signed up for the anti-FISA group on his own website?

Posted at July 3, 2008 2:52 PM in response to A Time-line Of Obama's Statements On FISA

Actually, I think that bit of common wisdom is dead wrong. I know lots of people believe that line of thinking despite the horrendous track record following through on it has generated but based on the repeated failure of this strategy to immunize Democrats from criticism I think it's time for a new approach, e.g. standing up for what you know is right.

The entire problem that got us to this point is, in fact, that mind set. The fear of being criticized as being weak leads to Democrats repeatedly demonstrating the truth in it by capitulating to right wing demands. What they haven't tried is actually standing up for what they believe in. They are going to receive the very same criticism no matter what they do so what is the advantage of giving in to the bullying? Zero.

Posted at July 3, 2008 2:34 PM in response to Group Urging Obama To Oppose FISA Cave Now Biggest On His Web Site

This little problem could easily have been avoided. Obama brought this on himself by committing a gigantically hypocritically flip flop that he didn't need to engage in, in order to win, and the matter can be handledto the satisfaction of all in numerous ways that doesn't make Obama seem to flip back after flopping to the right.

I think the pressure being exherted upon him by his own supporters is a good thing in many ways despite the howls from those who worship him. He's our nominee. He will get the votes of the anti-FISA liberals, but it's an issue that means a lot to an important constituency of his and he has literally asked people to do this. The truth is, throughout the primaries Obama's rhetoric about joining "the movement" has been instructing people that they will need to do this sort of thing once he gets elected. Supporters are just taking the concept for a test drive on FISA.

It is true that FISA is an issue the average guy on the street doesn't know much about or understand well. However, Obama clearly believes that he can just leap to the right on this and other matter blithely ignoring an important part of his base which is, in the estimation of many of his supporters, a massive error, incredibly arrogant and politically foolish. FISA is just one symbolic issue among many where Obama is tacking hard right as seems to be required by the villagers even though that isn't what people voted for in the primaries. Obama needs to have some respect for who got him nominated and in the end it was not Axelrod or anyone with lots of good ideas in Washington: it was the people who actually cast votes for him and the many, many liberals who fueled his money machine online and otherwise---well over 10,000 of them now members of the online group beseeching him to vote against FISA.

The FISA "problem", as it were, can easily be handled by bottling it up or otherwise allowing it to die on the vine in Congress via parliamentary means and that is what should happen. There's plenty of time to orchestrate that which we know very well since it was done previously. No reason it cannot be done again. No reason at all.

There are endless ways this can be made to happen. Reid, Pelosi or both of them can relieve Obama of this pressure individually or separately and that's how this problem should be solved. They created it. They can make it go away.

The leaders never should have allowed this legislation to reach the floor of either chamber. Now that they have foolishly tried to shove this down the throats of the people in return for huge contributions from the telecoms (what a co-inky-dink huh?), they can and should kill it because it clearly is causing Obama a political problem first because he has obviously flip-flopped (the political cover excuses about national security are absurd and false) and second the pressure is boxing him in and making the flip flop a genuine liability. The best way for the issue to go away without making Obama look even more weak and hypcritical is to kill it in parliamentary fashion and make sure it does not resurface.

Pelosi, Hoyer and Emmanuel particularly got the literal payoff they wanted from their corporate constituents in the telecom industry so they'll just have to face them and throw their hands up with a lame excuse about how they couldn't prevent whatever they come up with which is the treatment the Democratic base usually gets and a practice, I might add, that needs to come to a screeching halt. It's time for the rich and powerful interests to find out what it's like to be on the losing end for once. This tactic allows Obama's problem to get solved without any fingerprints of his to be found and liberals are left with no complaint on the issue which allows them to continue to be enthusiastic about the candidate and concentrate on winning in the fall.

Sometimes it is important for citizens to intervene like thise in order to protect their interests. The left is crucial to Obama winning and if he takes them for granted now and flip flops on an important issue to the left such as this, it will only be worse once he's elected. The wealthy and corporate interests never hesitate to flex their muscles. Why is it that so many believe citizens (and in this case an active segment of the netroots) should not do likewise?

Posted at July 3, 2008 11:03 AM in response to Group Urging Obama To Oppose FISA Cave Now Biggest On His Web Site

Carter barely lost in 1980. Electoral landslide yes, popular landslide: no. Had Teddy not challenged Carter, chances are he would have served a second term.

Also, what about Nader in 2000? He may not have been the deciding factor, but his candidacy sure didn't help Gore.

Then there's also Humphrey in 1968 who was relentlessly challenged from the left by McCarthy and RFK and then after being nominated he was hounded by protesters everywhere he went. They were criticizing from the left.

Posted at July 2, 2008 3:41 PM in response to Story Of Anti-FISA Group On Obama's Web Site Goes National

Obviouly Obama is better tha McCain, the problem is that is not what the choice was supposed to have been. Primary voters were sold a bill of goods.

I wish I shared your confidence in team Obama, but I do not believe Axelrod, et al do know what they are doing. They are following a tired Washington script that has failed over and over. They have never run a national campaign before. It shows in part because they are committing the sae mistakes Democrats committed in 2000 and 2004. This strategy didn't work well for Kerry and it didn't work well for Gore. It is even less likely to work well for Obama in my opinion. Focus groups have their uses, however, without any general focus group to rely on, we still know what mkes Americans tick and we know the kinds of things that are necessary to make sure they vote the right way. Cowering and trying to defend one's self from te attacks of the right wing by becoming more like them weakens Democrats because it does nothing to prevent the attacks one is trying to stave off and only makes the Democrat look like a pussy quite frankly.

That's the whole Republican strategy: make the Democrats look like pussies. The easiest way to do that is by getting them to back down and support things they don't really support, etc... In other words you don't do precisely what it is Obama is doing.

Yes, he will be attacked but so what? Does that come as a surprise to anyone? It shouldn't. For their leader, Americans want someone who will stick to his guns, they don't want someone who is going to back down---as Democrats do consistently which only makes it easier for the opposition to say to the voters: "See? I told ya! Democrats aren't really interested in defending the country. They only say they will when election time comes around..." Then they trot out the series of flip flops on things like FISA, etc... to prove it.

Posted at July 1, 2008 6:43 PM in response to Fake Left, Cut Right